Wednesday, 20 August 2008

consent

In discussions of bdsm the point is always made strongly that it is fine as long as the activities are between "consenting adults".

I am coming to the view though that "consent" is not enough - it should be "desire".

8 comments:

David said...

Would the two of you even be there seeking consent if desire had not brought you together?

bloodsweattears said...

I agree with David.

Rose

Anonymous said...

Where perception is, there also are pain and pleasure, and where these are, there, of necessity, is desire.

ARISTOTLE

suze said...

Skip over the part that I was practicing bdsm activity w/a married Dom (a whole nuther conversation)but in our talks, I saw that there was a stark difference between why I was doing it and why his wife was. She began with zero desire for bdsm and unaccepting of this trait in him---they did not marry, but parted over it, then began again years later when she chose to participate in bdsm activities out of love for him. Down deep, she may still hold no real desire for the activity itself, but consents, as in her mind & heart, it furnishes her with with the man she does desire beyond anything else. In my eyes, she has always appeared as the consummate submissive for her choice, and it is very possible that he needs someone who he knows wants him with or without the bdsm. (just as a wealthy man wants to know if someone would still love him when poor.)

I do desire bdsm activity, and simply cannot imagine accepting the physicality of it without that craving. I doubt love alone would get me through it at times, and I doubt my ex-Dom would have ever called me a submissive with a straight face.

Point is that we must go back to the fact that different people come to it motivated by reasons of their own. More than consent may be necessary for you and your partners, and it is good that you recognize that.

Were you thinking of a specific incident?

p.s. And of course it is semantics sometimes, but what about those who desire the feelings of not consenting? So many levels, so little time!

Pygar said...

Again - thank you all!

I think Aristotle has it about right!!!!

But my reason for posting was to gently raise the points that Suze wrote about so articulately.

I don't want my sub to submit to me through duty or even love. I want her to desire it. I want her to desire it as much as me. Yes I know there are situations where a sub may start though duty and grow to love and desire bdsm activities. In such cases then I think this should be the goal. Again this is looking for more than mere consent.

This is not about a particular experience of mine - just an issue I wanted to raise.

Thanks again for the thoughtful responses.

xPx

elle said...

i wish i could remember where i found this so i can give proper credit to the author, nor am i sure of the exact words, but you'll understand the intent. i obivously thought it poignant enough to keep.

Even if you decide to try and dominate me, that without understanding the inherent eroticism, it is similar to mechanically following a set of written instructions, without truly understanding what you are doing or why. The end result lacks the feeling and eroticism necessary to create a fulfilling experience. Part of the enjoyment (on both our parts) is also knowing that the other person is enjoying it also. When the one of us is going through the motions to please the other, but finds no personal turn-on related to this activity, a significant part of the enjoyment is lost.

Constance said...

We talk about my obligation to do as I'm told, which is very real, but in truth, it wouldn't be as good for either one of us if not for the fact that we are opposite sides of the same coin. We both desire it.

Pygar said...

Thank you elle - yes I have to know the other person is "enjoying it". "Enjoying" may not be quite the right word - but certainly gaining satisfaction and some fulfillment from it.

As Constance said - when "we both desire it".