Sunday, 12 August 2018


This post was inspired by a comment by Fondles to my previous post Are men just wimps?  You can read her comment here.

In it she writes,
"It's easy to say, hey, sure, I'll spank / whip / hit you. But women (or so I'm told) are fickle creatures, and it's not difficult to imagine how an argument could escalate into finger pointing and police reports being filed. Anything taken out of context could sound like a crime."

Whether fickle or not, people can change their minds at a later date. They can have regrets. Things might not have turned out as wonderfully as they had hoped. Or perhaps a relationship breaks down in a resentful and acrimonious way. Reporting BDSM activities out of context would certainly be seen as abuse by the authorities.

I can imagine the interview question,
"Did you on such and such a date engage in the following activities with X..."
Then the response,
"Well, yes, BUT..."

I'm not sure how well the "BUT" would play out in such a scenario. Not well I imagine.

I wonder if this plays any part at all in the questions I asked in the previous post. Or is it anyway something that Doms should bear carefully in mind?


neriche said...

I don't know that I have a whole lot to offer on this except to say that I have been told by more than one kinkster at more than one munch that the Portland, Oregon BDSM community here is very self-policing. Any Dom or Top who acts without consent will have far fewer play partners to choose from as a result (newbies and the unsuspecting few who are not plugged into the community). That alone seems to be another layer -- in addition to local law authorities -- that keeps consent in check. It may be even more effective than the law, in fact.

Fondles said...

Its all very sensitive i think, and im sure we could benefit from some dom-types (of both genders) weighing in.

But yeah, i personally think this might be at least one of the considerations if not the main or only one that a dom might think about when beginning any new relationship.

On the other hand if the forum where the two were to meet is known for or explicitly meant for kink-positive members to interact, then i should think it would be easier to find a dom who was willing to spank. :)

Pygar said...

Thanks neriche.

Yes, I think that good scenes like the Portland one that you suggest can be self-policing in very efficient ways. However, the point was more about what might happen when someone had regrets afterwards - perhaps especially about activities in private spaces that could even have been over a long period.

It could be that someone gave their consent at the time but later when the relationship soured felt uncomfortable about things they had done and then made accusations of abuse. I think such cases must be quite rare, though I can imagine a situation where a sub who got carried away at the time with all the endorphins flowing might have later regrets. If those led to complaints being made then that could be a serious issue for the Dom. However the more I think about this the more I believe it is incumbent on the Dom to ensure throughout that everything is fine with their sub and if there are regrets afterwards then perhaps that may well be the fault of the Dom?

So perhaps I am over-worrying about a sub making unfair accusations against a Dom. Perhaps we should always be more concerned about the opposite. It would be awful if abusive Doms got away with their behaviour because of thoughts of the kinds of scenarios I have introduced here.

P xx

Pygar said...

Yes Fondles, I do occasionally get comments on here from other Doms of both (all?) sexes and different sexual orientations. Sadly there have been fewer recently and it would be good to have more from differing perspectives. Recently most contributors have also been from M/f relationships with a few F/f though in the past I have had contributions from F/m. I think though very few from M/m. The male gay D/s community seem often to have their own scene but I am sure many of the issues are the same and I was linked to a little while ago from a very good Gay D/s site.

As you say though if the couple have met on a D/s website for instance then that at least gives some perspective to the situation. It also makes me wonder again about my previous post as to why subs cannot find someone to give them a spanking. There seem to be lots of profiles on Fetlife for instance of Doms of all sexual orientations quite eager to find a sub with whom they can engage in a vigorous spanking session. (Other D/s social network sites are available!)

Finding a safe Dom or the right Dom is a whole different question...

Thanks Fondles

P xx

neriche said...

My mistake. I think I misread, or read too quickly. To your point, and I'm going to be a bit crass now so apologies, I was at a recent munch and one SubF, who doesn't perform oral sex, said (paraphrasing),
"When I'm playing and deeply enjoying myself, I may well be inspired to give him a blowjob. I may even REALLY want to give him a blowjob. I may beg to do so. Does that mean I -- in my rational mind -- want his dick in my mouth? HELL NO. And hopefully he will remember that and have the integrity to not push that limit in THAT moment." (To everyone's amusement, she went on to say what she would do to a Dom who did push that limit.)

This spoke to me. I think we have all been in that place where we found ourselves in the flow of the moment, with the endorphins going as you said, feeling the pull to do things outside of our comfort zone...maybe even things that, moments before, were a clear limit. Especially as submissives, it is arousing to want to give pleasure. Indeed, the desire to please and indulge when in my submissive mode shocks me. It's well beyond the pull of desire I felt in my vanilla experiences. Especially for a younger newbie, such mental/physical/emotional sensations would likely render them quite vulnerable and disoriented.

IMO, the responsibility lies with both the Dom and the sub. The sub has a responsibility to choose the Dom wisely, and communicate their limits to the Dom. The Dom has a responsibility to listen, understand, and not push those limits during vulnerable moments when the sub may later regret his/her actions. Among other safeguards, I am beginning to see the value of written spite of their awkwardness.

Pygar said...

Thanks neriche

No I don't think it is "crass". I think you have given an excellent example of what I was trying to get at. Being a Dom in that situation I certainly would not want to experience her retaliation!

You write,
"I think we have all been in that place where we found ourselves in the flow of the moment, with the endorphins going as you said, feeling the pull to do things outside of our comfort zone...maybe even things that, moments before, were a clear limit. Especially as submissives, it is arousing to want to give pleasure. Indeed, the desire to please and indulge when in my submissive mode shocks me. It's well beyond the pull of desire I felt in my vanilla experiences. "
And yes, those moments can be the most exciting and fulfilling - but also have the potential to be the ones with later consequences.

I think you have got to the heart of the issue.

Thank you

P xxxx

Fondles said...

As Neriche said - the desire to please, especially in young/new/eager subs (perhaps wanting to prove how good they are) might be something a Dom should be aware of, and if good communication channels are in place there should be adequate feedback always.

As for why subs on Fetlife (for eg) dont seem to be able to find a Dom, i wonder, do Doms find it more satisfying/challenging to “bend” a girl (or partner) to their will, and so a girl offering to be submissive is deemed “easy”? Im just throwing ideas out here. And good point on worrying more about abusive Doms. I have read blogs where the sub writing shows clear signs of fear. Actual crippling fear. And i think to myself thats not what D/s is about. But oh well.

I also wonder (going back to such D/s sites as Fetlife) if a sub who is looking for a Dom to spank her (im going to just use the M/f model here cos its easier to stick to one) might be wary of a Dom who advertises such. Perhaps fear that he might be abusive since he is so KEEN to spank. I feel as if we could be talking till the cows come home and not get any nearer to figuring out the reason for this phenomenon!

Thank u for asking the question. It has goven me much to think on.

Fondles said...


Pygar said...

Thank you Fondles for sharing the ways this topic has taken your thoughts.

All the issues you raise are very interesting - though I have no answers either! Are Doms wanting someone to bend to their will? Could that be more satisfying than discovering someone who is desperate to submit? Or are Subs fearful that Doms too eager to spank may in fact be abusers? I think there may be much in your questions.

I wonder if any others have answers?

P xx

Princess said...

Hmmm. That is why communication is important at *every* step and esp before any contact happens. No, it is not dreamy and romantic like the sexy hot books. but it makes things work better, that boundaries are drawn. Less stress, less worry, less pain. Safewords and contracts and all exist for a reason.

Women do change minds, after all. As men do. If I'm having an intense bout of arguing with a man, I'm not one who just forgets it, has a boffing session then picks my anger back up. Until my mind is settled, my body isn't either. YMMV and it should.

I'm wary of a man who cannot wait to try out all of his spanking implements on whomever is around. Just a safety/sanity issue. But I'm not a freewheeler in that area--I'm one to take my time, I don't rush.

As I'm not a sub, a number of questions I cannot answer. If I were, I might be anxious to 'play along' with a man who checks the boxes on my list.That might cause me to get involved in something to heavy to me--hell, it once did!

Bad enough I run into men who think because I'm sweet and relatively friendly, that there is room to bend me to their will. I have been told that on one hand, an experienced woman wants to surrender is a diamond but on the other, that getting a woman who really isn't 'into it" to play along is delicious.

(Playing with a specific man does not quality me to hold a seminar. I can offer my personal thoughts on what I have done.)

The base of any successful interaction is trust and honesty. It is not enough to both like leather, latex or sex toys. There has to be a true common ground.

Pygar said...

Thanks Princess. There is so much in there. I hope readers look carefully at it.

As you say,
"Women do change minds, after all. As men do."

And afterwards we can all have regrets. I am sure we have all been there in all sorts of different contexts. How though do those regrets manifest themselves? And given the more extreme nature of BDSM and strength of emotion perhaps those feelings could be even stronger.

Very importantly you also write, and it is a common thread running though all my posts, "communication is important at *every* step and esp before any contact happens".

It must be at the centre for the well being of all of us.

P xx